stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: You can search for the discussion. I won't do the work for you if you're lazy. No need to search. I remember the conversations because it was very frustrating. You cherry pick parts of my answers that you wish to answer and skipped over questions you didn't. I can't say it was the most "truth seeking" conversation. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 3 minutes ago, stahleyp said: That is not proof. I can not see in their hearts. You have shown us no proof. You have shown yourself no proof. You may be fooling yourself. Bias and delusion are real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 2 minutes ago, stahleyp said: No need to search. I remember the conversations because it was very frustrating. You cherry pick parts of my answers that you wish to answer and skipped over questions you didn't. I can't say it was the most "truth seeking" conversation. You make assumptions and infer narratives to protect your ego. When you ask unimportant questions, I ignore them instead of wasting my time. Internally, you see that as avoidance and you infer superiority from it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: You have shown us no proof. You have shown yourself no proof. You may be fooling yourself. Bias and delusion are real. I agree. I have no proof that conscience is directed by God. I only have logically conclusions. My basic thinking goes like this: Do moral truths exist? Yes or no. If one believes they exist, what foundation do you build that on? If it's strictly evolution (ie evolutionary instincts) morality is simply an illusion. There is no right or wrong - just opinions of it. If that's the case, people like Hitler are just as moral as someone like Mother Theresa. Donald Trump is just as moral as Jesus. All of these folks are simply operating on their evolutionary instincts. And all of these instincts come from the same source. Morality "superiority" is an illusion. It is okay for homosexuals to be thrown off a building in the Middle-East as it is to celebrate gay marriage here, right? Now, if one believes moral truths exist, then you have a very solid (and logical) foundation for a belief in God. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) 30 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: You make assumptions and infer narratives to protect your ego. When you ask unimportant questions, I ignore them instead of wasting my time. Internally, you see that as avoidance and you infer superiority from it. Which of my questions are "unimportant"? Edited August 17 by stahleyp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 9 minutes ago, stahleyp said: I only have logically conclusions. That's impressive that you have no bias or delusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Perhaps more likely is that your "only logic" is a delusion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 48 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: Perhaps more likely is that your "only logic" is a delusion. How can one subgroup (people that through homosexual off buildings) be better or worse than people celebrating gay "marriage"? How could Jesus be better than Trump? Is there some magical morality we're supposed to follow? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 51 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: That's impressive that you have no bias or delusion. Is my conclusion not logical? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 52 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: Perhaps more likely is that your "only logic" is a delusion. Oh, I have plenty. I just don't think this is one. I'm still waiting to for you to refute anything I've said or show me where my logic is faulty. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) deleted Edited August 17 by ERICOPOLY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 6 minutes ago, stahleyp said: Oh, I have plenty. I just don't think this is one. I'm still waiting to for you to refute anything I've said or show me where my logic is faulty. Well, you just said "I just don't think this is one" as a rebuttal to the suggestion that as a human you are prone to bias and delusion. So, there you go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: Well, you just said "I just don't think this is one" as a rebuttal to the suggestion that as a human you are prone to bias and delusion. So, there you go. I'm referring to my argument. I have plenty of biases. People have biases but their thinking can still be sound. If you can show me how it is not, I'll hear you out. Perhaps my feelings of morality are a delusion. I admit that. However, if that's the case, there is no actual right or wrong either. All morality is a delusion then, right? So it is totally okay to throw some people off of buildings based on sexuality? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 1 minute ago, stahleyp said: I'm referring to my argument. Yes and that's just it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: Yes and that's just it. Care to point out why I'm wrong? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 2 minutes ago, stahleyp said: Perhaps my feelings of morality are a delusion. I admit that. However, if that's the case, there is no actual right or wrong either. All morality is a delusion then, right? It looks like a slippery slope fallacy when you argue that there exists no morality if Paul's god delusion is real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 And the world and all of its morality centers around you of course. That's part of it. If the voices you hear internally are not from God, then that impacts all of the world around you as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 2 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: It looks like a slippery slope fallacy when you argue that there exists no morality if Paul's god delusion is real. Sure. Can you give me an alternative? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) 3 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: And the world and all of its morality centers around you of course. That's part of it. If the voices you hear internally are not from God, then that impacts all of the world around you as well. Well, I don't hear voices but if God doesn't move my conscience then I have no reason to trust it. Nor do I have a reason to think it's true. If moral truths don't exist then neither do moral lies. Maybe Hitler was a decent fellow after all? Edited August 17 by stahleyp Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, stahleyp said: Sure. Can you give me an alternative? Will morality end when you die? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: Will morality end when you die? Nope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, stahleyp said: Nope. Well then will you speak from the grave? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 Just now, ERICOPOLY said: Well then will you speak from the grave? Nope. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ERICOPOLY Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 (edited) Good, then according to your arguments morality will be interpreted by the people who remain alive and who absorb morality from God through their hearts. Then if homosexuals who have faith and have no conflict of conscience outlive everyone else then there will be nothing to dispute their morality and they will be indisputably moral by definition. Therefore God is not the judge of their morality, people like you are. Edited August 17 by ERICOPOLY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stahleyp Posted August 17 Share Posted August 17 2 minutes ago, ERICOPOLY said: Good, then according to your arguments morality will be interpreted by the people who remain alive and who absorb morality from God through their hearts. Then if homosexuals who have faith and have no conflict of conscience outlive everyone else then there will be nothing to dispute their morality and they will be indisputably moral by definition. Therefore God is not the judge of their morality, people like you are. That doesn't make any sense. Morality is part of God's being. As Jesus said "“Why do you call me good?” Jesus answered. “No one is good—except God alone." Mark 10:18 Even if the whole world rejected God, He is still the standard of morality. Even if humans did not exist, morality would because it is part of God. By your reasoning, if the Nazis would have won WWII and killed off all the homosexuals and all non-Nazis then they would be the judge of morality, right? Do you honestly believe this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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