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Canadian Truckers Freedom Convoy 2022


backtothebeach
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in case you have not seen it because mainstream media is trying to ignore it:

Tens of thousands of truckers, cheered on by supporters on bridges and lining the streets, will be descending on Ottawa this weekend to protest against vaccine mandates.

Trudeau conveniently says he has to self isolate for 5 days. Calls them “fringe” people having “unacceptable views”.

 

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It is so true: truckers (and doctors and nurses) kept everybody alive and fed during the last two years.

Putting their lives on the line during the more dangerous variants. Many have had Covid and have natural immunity, but are losing their jobs because they don’t want to comply with one-size-fits-all vaccine mandates that don’t even recognize natural immunity.

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On 1/28/2022 at 8:27 AM, backtothebeach said:

It is so true: truckers (and doctors and nurses) kept everybody alive and fed during the last two years.

Putting their lives on the line during the more dangerous variants. Many have had Covid and have natural immunity, but are losing their jobs because they don’t want to comply with one-size-fits-all vaccine mandates that don’t even recognize natural immunity.

The stupidity of this shit is mind-boggling...kind of like this graphic Greg put up on the other board:

image.thumb.jpeg.d49138a7266e1e172b9547b56fd7a35c.jpeg

The irony is that in 1942 we had conscription...where the government told healthy men that they were going to go fight a war in another country to preserve the safety and freedoms of the West and modern Democracy.  Most people supported this idea.  Those that didn't fulfill their draft requirement were charged and prosecuted, while many fled the country and were called "draft dodgers!"

Today, you have the government asking its citizens to get vaccinated to preserve the safety of the general population, those most vulnerable, and prevent our healthcare systems from being overwhelmed and breaking down.  Yet, you have people who defy their government's call, expect to have a hospital bed waiting for them if they do get sick from Covid, and are ok infringing on the rights of others by getting other people sick. 

I think those that don't want to get vaccinated, are no different than draft dodgers from past wars...your country is asking you to make sacrifices for the protection of other citizens!  If you don't want to get vaccinated there absolutely should be penalties and you shouldn't expect a bed for you at a hospital where you would be taking the spot of someone who needs crucial surgery, care or did try and prevent getting Covid.  Cheers!

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On 1/28/2022 at 8:20 AM, backtothebeach said:

Another good one:

 

Your "Tens of thousands of truckers" ended up being a few hundred in reality, but don't let the mainstream media confuse you!

Less than 5% of the trucking industry not willing to do what their other brethren have already done to support their families.  Instead, let's protest the government mandate instead of feeding our families.  Good on you!  Make sure they don't collect EI as well.  Cheers!

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4 hours ago, Parsad said:

The stupidity of this shit is mind-boggling...kind of like this graphic Greg put up on the other board:

image.thumb.jpeg.d49138a7266e1e172b9547b56fd7a35c.jpeg

The irony is that in 1942 we had conscription...where the government told healthy men that they were going to go fight a war in another country to preserve the safety and freedoms of the West and modern Democracy.  Most people supported this idea.  Those that didn't fulfill their draft requirement were charged and prosecuted, while many fled the country and were called "draft dodgers!"

Today, you have the government asking its citizens to get vaccinated to preserve the safety of the general population, those most vulnerable, and prevent our healthcare systems from being overwhelmed and breaking down.  Yet, you have people who defy their government's call, expect to have a hospital bed waiting for them if they do get sick from Covid, and are ok infringing on the rights of others by getting other people sick. 

I think those that don't want to get vaccinated, are no different than draft dodgers from past wars...your country is asking you to make sacrifices for the protection of other citizens!  If you don't want to get vaccinated there absolutely should be penalties and you shouldn't expect a bed for you at a hospital where you would be taking the spot of someone who needs crucial surgery, care or did try and prevent getting Covid.  Cheers!

You said "Today, you have the government asking its citizens to get vaccinated to preserve the safety of the general population, those most vulnerable, and prevent our healthcare systems from being overwhelmed and breaking down"

Where are you getting such data?  Look at UK surveillance report here. Table 13, page 47 in below link:

Age 50-59 Case rates per 100,000

Vaccinated 3 doses 3,894.4

Unvaccined 1,928.0

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1050721/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-4.pdf

Yes the table also indicates less hospitalization with vaccination, but that is not protecting someone else. That is protecting him/her self.  A person of different co-morbidities, prior infection, age may look at the side effects and benefits and make a decision for themselves.  What is wrong with that?  If your concern is helping someone else, the data is clear above.

Both US and Canada had biggest peaks in cases in last few months.  Does that argue that vaccination is reducing spread of virus?

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1 hour ago, Investor20 said:

You said "Today, you have the government asking its citizens to get vaccinated to preserve the safety of the general population, those most vulnerable, and prevent our healthcare systems from being overwhelmed and breaking down"

Where are you getting such data?  Look at UK surveillance report here. Table 13, page 47 in below link:

Age 50-59 Case rates per 100,000

Vaccinated 3 doses 3,894.4

Unvaccined 1,928.0

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/1050721/Vaccine-surveillance-report-week-4.pdf

Yes the table also indicates less hospitalization with vaccination, but that is not protecting someone else. That is protecting him/her self.  A person of different co-morbidities, prior infection, age may look at the side effects and benefits and make a decision for themselves.  What is wrong with that?  If your concern is helping someone else, the data is clear above.

Both US and Canada had biggest peaks in cases in last few months.  Does that argue that vaccination is reducing spread of virus?

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/01/13/1072902744/ers-are-overwhelmed-as-omicron-continues-to-flood-them-with-patients

https://globalnews.ca/news/8500892/covid-omicron-hospital-capacity-surgery-delay/

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2022/01/27/omicron-severity

https://globalnews.ca/news/8504204/bc-covid-surgery-delay-update-january-2022/

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/with-more-than-500-000-fewer-surgeries-due-to-covid-19-delayed-surgeries-cost-some-their-lives-1.5700480

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/01/25/omicron-infections-hospitalizations-deaths/

There are hundreds of other articles indicating clearly that unvaccinated patients and those that are immune compromised are the bulk of severe respiratory Covid-related cases.  These cases are clogging up hospitals and delaying hundreds of thousands of surgeries (in Canada alone)...in other words, people choosing not to get vaccinated, but who subsequently get Covid (doesn't matter which variant) are taking up a bed, clogging ER's, etc where another patient could have been treated and are also indirectly delaying surgeries that may cost lives.

That means that individual, as long as they don't have issues that prevent them from getting a vaccine, are affecting/hurting other people when they could easily prevent that.  I'm not sure what is difficult to grasp here?

Cheers!

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3 hours ago, Parsad said:

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2022/01/13/1072902744/ers-are-overwhelmed-as-omicron-continues-to-flood-them-with-patients

https://globalnews.ca/news/8500892/covid-omicron-hospital-capacity-surgery-delay/

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2022/01/27/omicron-severity

https://globalnews.ca/news/8504204/bc-covid-surgery-delay-update-january-2022/

https://www.ctvnews.ca/health/coronavirus/with-more-than-500-000-fewer-surgeries-due-to-covid-19-delayed-surgeries-cost-some-their-lives-1.5700480

https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2022/01/25/omicron-infections-hospitalizations-deaths/

There are hundreds of other articles indicating clearly that unvaccinated patients and those that are immune compromised are the bulk of severe respiratory Covid-related cases.  These cases are clogging up hospitals and delaying hundreds of thousands of surgeries (in Canada alone)...in other words, people choosing not to get vaccinated, but who subsequently get Covid (doesn't matter which variant) are taking up a bed, clogging ER's, etc where another patient could have been treated and are also indirectly delaying surgeries that may cost lives.

That means that individual, as long as they don't have issues that prevent them from getting a vaccine, are affecting/hurting other people when they could easily prevent that.  I'm not sure what is difficult to grasp here?

Cheers!

Those are overwhelmengly people with co-morbidities or older age. Look at the rates of hospitalization in the UK surveillance report i linked to in earlier post.

50 deaths per 100,000 for ages above 80 with 3 jabs

3.0 deaths per 100,000 for ages 40-49 without vaccination

And among those high level of people with co-morbidities.

In a recent Freedom of information Act disclosure UK government published

"death registrations for 2020 and 2021 (provisional) that were due to COVID-19 and were recorded without any pre-existing conditions, England and Wales.

2020: 9400 (0-64: 1549 / 65 and over: 7851)"

That is all of 2020, only 1549 deaths of people below 65 without co-morbidities.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathsfromcovid19withnootherunderlyingcauses?s=09

If your desire is to protect vulnerable people, you need younger healthier people to carry less Covid (is that with or without vaccination? Check the data).  Because it is older people with co-morbidities are the one vulnerable.  But this is not politically correct to say.  However, older people with 3 jabs are much more vulnerable than younger without vaccination.  Just check the UK government official data.

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1. Many, maybe most of these truckers and protesters are vaccinated, but are against mandates. With omicron providing massive amounts of natural immunity, there is a good argument that mandates are an unnecessary invasion into people’s freedoms.

2. There’s no scientific reason why people with antibody and T cell immunity from previous infection need to be vaccinated and fired from their job if they don’t.

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Anti-semitic and confederate flags, dancing, urinating and defecating on our national memorials. Stealing food from the homeless, crashing a local soup kitchen and demanding to be fed.

And all this to protest a vaccine requirement at the border that means nothing since the US has the same requirement. Yup, fine people indeed.

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8 hours ago, cwericb said:

Anti-semitic and confederate flags, dancing, urinating and defecating on our national memorials. Stealing food from the homeless, crashing a local soup kitchen and demanding to be fed.

And all this to protest a vaccine requirement at the border that means nothing since the US has the same requirement. Yup, fine people indeed.

The media are playing you like a fiddle. Report on the 1% of the people that are misbehaving, paint the rest as lunatics. Nice framing.

https://thepostmillennial.com/canadian-trucker-convoy-confront-masked-man-confederate-flag

In the meantime, is the UK the first country that is getting smart? 

https://www.dailywire.com/news/u-k-plans-to-end-vaccination-requirements-for-health-care-workers

👍

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12 hours ago, backtothebeach said:

The media are playing you like a fiddle. Report on the 1% of the people that are misbehaving, paint the rest as lunatics. Nice framing.

https://thepostmillennial.com/canadian-trucker-convoy-confront-masked-man-confederate-flag

 

 

Really now? I am being “played like a fiddle”?  

When you have to support your opinion with an article from a right wing source with a questionable reputation, perhaps you should broaden your horizons a little.  
 
The Post Millennial is a conservative Canadian online news magazine started in 2017. It publishes national and local news and has a large amount of opinion content. It has been criticized for publishing false stories and COVID-19 disinformation, as well as for its opaque funding and political connections.”  Wikipedia.

Probably not the best source to use to criticize others.

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“Canadian Truckers Freedom Convoy 2022"     As Sanjeev said ... “The stupidity of this shit is mind-boggling...”

Here is just how stupid the whole thing is.

1) The protest was formed by a small minority of ill-advised Canadian truckers protesting the vaccination requirements at the Canadian side of the Canadian/U.S. border.

2) But the IDENTICAL requirement exists on the U.S. side of the border.

3) Therefore, even if the truckers were “successful” ... NOTHING would change.

Does that not make this about the dumbest protest ever?

Unfortunately the only thing accomplished to date is to give the far right an opportunity to hijack the protest, desecrate our national monuments, create havoc in the city, and push their own raciest agenda. Original supporters must be quite embarrassed.

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The protest originally targeted a Jan. 15 vaccine mandate for cross-border truck drivers, however it soon became a demonstration against all COVID measures.”

What’s so hard to understand about that?

Measures that Denmark and the UK are already getting rid of, so the protests are probably not “the stupidest shit ever”.

Everything else is a sideshow. A few idiots that don’t know how to behave, or a few assholes flying flags, some of them probably provocateurs, don’t change the story, except if you choose to focus on it.

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So I guess what this ‘protest’ has come down to is that a small minority of truckers and a bunch of right wing extremists who are all too selfish to get vaccinated are trying to force the rest of us into a premature relaxation of Covid restrictions.

As far as Britain and Denmark are concerned, I believe Omicron peaked there before it did in Canada, so wouldn’t it seem logical that they would relax restrictions before Canada does?

We all hope that this may be the last wave of Covid-19 and we can all get back to normal.

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On 1/31/2022 at 3:12 AM, Investor20 said:

Those are overwhelmengly people with co-morbidities or older age. Look at the rates of hospitalization in the UK surveillance report i linked to in earlier post.

50 deaths per 100,000 for ages above 80 with 3 jabs

3.0 deaths per 100,000 for ages 40-49 without vaccination

And among those high level of people with co-morbidities.

In a recent Freedom of information Act disclosure UK government published

"death registrations for 2020 and 2021 (provisional) that were due to COVID-19 and were recorded without any pre-existing conditions, England and Wales.

2020: 9400 (0-64: 1549 / 65 and over: 7851)"

That is all of 2020, only 1549 deaths of people below 65 without co-morbidities.

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/transparencyandgovernance/freedomofinformationfoi/deathsfromcovid19withnootherunderlyingcauses?s=09

If your desire is to protect vulnerable people, you need younger healthier people to carry less Covid (is that with or without vaccination? Check the data).  Because it is older people with co-morbidities are the one vulnerable.  But this is not politically correct to say.  However, older people with 3 jabs are much more vulnerable than younger without vaccination.  Just check the UK government official data.

On December 18th, my 96 year old grandmother entered hospital with Covid.  Why?  Because my anti-vaxxer jackass uncle, who she lives with, passed it on...or his unvaccinated wife...or perhaps his two school-age children who weren't vaccinated at the time.  He didn't take her to get vaccinated over the last year, so she was vulnerable.  She doesn't go anywhere, so it originated from one of the family members. 

The four family members are all fine, but my grandmother nearly lost her life over the holidays.  After a few weeks, she was sent home, but on Sunday went back to hospital due to the respiratory issues she developed when she had Covid.  We hope she recovers, but we don't know if she will.

So your studies might support your argument that young people have low morbidity rates from Covid, but the problem is that they can pass it on to other vulnerable people (vaccinated or unvaccinated).  My uncle nearly killed his own mother, and we aren't out of the woods. 

On top of that, over the last 55 days or so since my grandmother originally became ill, she has occupied a hospital bed for 25 of those days...a bed that someone else could have used, and resources that could have been made available to others who weren't infected by a poor decision that could have been prevented.

So people can argue all they want about freedom of choice, co-morbidities, etc...truth is that the unvaccinated continue transmission and mutation of the virus, which will continue to make people sick and will kill some of them. 

Do I believe it is time to start living with the virus, and start to open things up?  Yes.  But I also believe there should be mandatory vaccinations as we open things up, and those that choose not to get vaccinated, will be treated accordingly...last in line for hospital beds and medical resources; termination from workplaces that require vaccinations to protect their clients/patients including schools, senior homes, hospital facilities, etc; elimination of EI benefits if terminated for not being unvaccinated; prevented from entering group settings like arenas, theatres, restaurants, cafes, government offices, etc if unvaccinated and more!  

Cheers! 

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6 hours ago, PacmanCFA said:

"those that choose not to get vaccinated, will be treated accordingly..." 

LOL. What a strange thing to say. 🤣

What is strange about that?

The full quote reads ...

"...those that choose not to get vaccinated, will be treated accordingly... last in line for hospital beds and medical resources; termination from workplaces that require vaccinations to protect their clients/patients including schools, senior homes, hospital facilities, etc; elimination of EI benefits if terminated for not being unvaccinated; prevented from entering group settings like arenas, theatres, restaurants, cafes, government offices, etc if unvaccinated and more! "

Choices come with consequences.

Ironic isn't it, how those who believe THEY should have the 'freedom' to refuse to be vaccinated, believe that employers should NOT have the freedom to require their employees or customers be vaccinated. How they believe THEY should have the freedom  not to wear face masks, but that store owners should NOT have the freedom to require their staff and customers wear masks. 

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Lemme guess. These unvaxxed scums of the earth (which include ppl from ALL walks of life, including minorities, nurses, elderly, etc contrary to what you might think) will still need to pay into healthcare and EI, right?! No chance to opt out?

It's a strange statement b/c all you have to do is replace "vaccine" with something else to see how LOL it is. 

"those that choose not to (exercise regularly, give up alcohol, give up opioids, give up smoking, get their body fat % down, give up risk-taking activities, etc) will be treated accordingly."

It's mentally easier to just $hit on people and cast them as deplorable extreme right-wingers. But as a black/Filipino man in Scarborough with a large social circle, I can ASSURE you there's massive support for ANY voice/movement that opposes more mandates (and not from the races of people that you'd think). 

BTW, I'm double-vaxxed, have gotten covid, have had loved ones pass from covid, have elderly immunocompromised parents, and have a young family. But it's never crossed my mind ONCE to blame my fellow neighbors for "KILLING" those close to me or putting MY parents or family at risk. LOL. It's such a weirrrd take. 

 

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26 minutes ago, PacmanCFA said:

 But as a black/Filipino man in Scarborough with a large social circle, I can ASSURE you there's massive support for ANY voice/movement that opposes more mandates (and not from the races of people that you'd think).

Well I'm not sure anyone is looking for more mandates and hopefully, we might be getting over the hump on this whole mess and we can get back to normal.

But why are you attempting to bring race into the discussion about truckers protesting? Or is it in response to the fact  that some protesters were anti-Semitic and others were flying Confederate flags at a protest you seem to support?
 
So you don’t think that someone who has Covid-19 and ignores mandates for masks, self isolation, etc. bares no responsibility for spreading the disease?

That employers don’t have the right to specify qualifications for their employees?

That store or business owners have no right to exclude some people from entrance to their premises? Familiar with: “No, shirt, no shoes, no service”.

And that governments have no right to initiate laws to control pandemics.

I guess we just disagree.

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But why are you attempting to bring race into the discussion about truckers protesting? Or is it in response to the fact  that some protesters were anti-Semitic and others were flying Confederate flags at a protest you seem to support?

Yep. In the same way I clown right-wing media for painting BLM protests in a certain light, I say the same w/ mainstream when they do their own version of narrative crafting. 

So you don’t think that someone who has Covid-19 and ignores mandates for masks, self isolation, etc. bares no responsibility for spreading the disease?

1 million cases per day. Many from places with super high vax rates. Going on nearly 3 years now. My whole household has gotten COVID....probably from other fam and friends who are vaxxed. It hurts my brain to think about who I should blame and why. I just settle on it's a fn contagious ass disease and everyone's gonna get it. 

That employers don’t have the right to specify qualifications for their employees? That store or business owners have no right to exclude some people from entrance to their premises? Familiar with: “No, shirt, no shoes, no service”. 

I agree private businesses have every right to do this. 

And that governments have no right to initiate laws to control pandemics.

I believe government overreach is a thing. History shows us this. Our rulers haven't just become enlightened benevolent humanitarians looking out for our best interests lol. Politics is always at play. But yeah, we'll probably disagree on where that line is drawn. 

Well I'm not sure anyone is looking for more mandates and hopefully, we might be getting over the hump on this whole mess and we can get back to normal.

Amen, dude. 

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10 hours ago, PacmanCFA said:

Lemme guess. These unvaxxed scums of the earth (which include ppl from ALL walks of life, including minorities, nurses, elderly, etc contrary to what you might think) will still need to pay into healthcare and EI, right?! No chance to opt out?

It's a strange statement b/c all you have to do is replace "vaccine" with something else to see how LOL it is. 

 

No, they can opt out of paying EI and healthcare.  If you are going to talk the talk, walk the walk!

Do you believe that mandates against second hand smoke contravene freedoms?  Probably not.  Yet the risks of serious illness and death are greater from Covid and you have a problem with mandatory vaccinations.

Do you believe the rights of any individual should infringe on the rights of any other individual?

Cheers!

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8 hours ago, Parsad said:

Do you believe that mandates against second hand smoke contravene freedoms?  Probably not. 

I go to hookah joints all the time where both smoking and 2nd hand smoke is allowed. But I don't bring my kids there. If smoking laws opened back up, I wouldn't go there. Simple. 

8 hours ago, Parsad said:

Do you believe the rights of any individual should infringe on the rights of any other individual?

Nope. But clearly we have a different definition of infringement of rights. MY definition doesn't require anyone to inject themselves with something that DOES have risks and that HAS injured people permanently (whether you want to acknowledge them, roll your eyes, or not). I just have never thought to judge my family, friends, and neighbors with real concerns. 

Millions of cases per day. With such high vax rates lol. Basic math tells us that vaxxed are spreading it to the vaxxed. I can tell you personally that my vaxxed household got it from my vaxxed family over Christmas.

Everyone's getting it which is the main reason many (especially the young folks) are DONE. "Are you getting the booster?" is met with a big FAT F NO because people are believing their OWN eyes now. That's why the booster isn't mandatory lol. You can only push people's "mandatory" limits so far. 

I have all sorts of ideas that would make society 'better' and cause less healthcare strain. A fat-tax for the obese (obesity is the biggest risk factor for cardiovascular disease, diabetes, and osteoarthritis which are quite literally the TOP diagnoses for hospital care), banning alcohol, cigarettes, etc.

Do you REALLY want to go down the road of "those who strain the system more, pay more"? The way that breaks down probably isn't the way you'd like it to break down. 

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