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One of those holdouts, a Swedish-born pastor named Henning Jacobson, took his anti-vaccine crusade all the way to the U.S. Supreme Court. The nation's top justices issued a landmark 1905 ruling that legitimized the government’s authority to “reasonably” infringe upon personal freedoms during a public health crisis by issuing a fine to those who refused vaccination.

https://www.history.com/news/smallpox-vaccine-supreme-court

 

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I definitely think this is the risk. I actually kind of agree with where @musclemans head is at, although perhaps he is trying too hard to get the current data interpretations there. But for sure you

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Florida governor cannot stomp on the First Amendment:

 

The law, championed by Gov. Ron DeSantis, slaps businesses with a fine of $5,000 per violation for asking customers to prove they were inoculated against the coronavirus.

In her decision, Williams said Norwegian would likely succeed in a court trial with its argument that Florida's so-called "vaccine passport" ban risks public health and infringes on the cruise line's First Amendment rights.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/09/1025993459/judge-oks-cruise-lines-covid-vaccination-requirement-for-passengers-in-florida

Edited by ERICOPOLY
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16 hours ago, Gregmal said:

Yes, of course. Here I though there might be a problem in Florida. But fortunately I now see there are just 15,000 new cases daily and hospitalizations have only tripled tripled. No big deal.
 
Now if DeSanits can just outlaw those nuts who insist in wearing masks everything will just fine.

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2 hours ago, cwericb said:

Yes, of course. Here I though there might be a problem in Florida. But fortunately I now see there are just 15,000 new cases daily and hospitalizations have only tripled tripled. No big deal.
 
Now if DeSanits can just outlaw those nuts who insist in wearing masks everything will just fine.

Its truly amazing to me how you claim to be a Republican yet every chance you get to trumpet big brother government, or criticize those who want less government, you take it. 

 

And btw, FL is doing just fine. Their citizens aint covid obsessed nuts, the economy is booming, people actually want to live there and are moving there at record pace...Texas too. Meanwhile your type of government bureaucracy like NY? Not so much. Quite the opposite actually. Has Canada even opened their borders yet LOL. Folks dont want to be locked in cages. I think the snout protectors are fine, so Im not sure why there's riots at school board meetings...but America is founded on principals and one of those is freedom. 

 

And none of this has anything to do with the subject matter....that the CDC is blatantly misrepresenting data. This was the key, and entire motivation of their "error"...just give their media allies something to chomp at...

"After the initial CDC numbers were released, a deluge of negative press directed at Florida and Gov. Ron DeSantis ensued, leading the Florida DOH and other officials to take to Twitter to decry the error."

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I mean seriously, WTF is wrong with you people? Brainwashed now into "OMG 15k cases!" Who the fuck cares about cases? What, stop the world again? LOL. You have a vaccine that renders this virus more or less impotent. If you choose not to get it thats on you.

My sister is a nurse in Lakeland which is one of the biggest covid spots in FL. Maybe like 20% of folks there are vaccinated of something wild like that. She told me the other day "its insane, everyone coming in, whether they are there for it, or not, has covid. Work sucks, buts its what we signed up for and not everyone likes their jobs so this isnt any different. Some people just think it is"...

Life is about choices. You want a mask, vaccine, or bout with the virus? Thats on you. Dont like the way things are run where you live? Move! If you dont like how De Santis/Abbott do things...no one is forcing you to go there. But the numbers(the real ones, not case counts) from the "pandemic" are tallying up fast, and its clear who the winners and losers are. I mean FL/TX are booming in every facet, meanwhile sleezebag on one coast was just forced to resign and the other guy on the other coast is being recalled....

 

Edited by Gregmal
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Greg, first off you are kind of out of touch here when you say... “Has Canada even opened their borders yet LOL.”

Yes, Canada has opened the border with the US. The US has refused to open the border to Canada.

I am not now a Republican, nor would I be. Yes I essentially have relatively conservative views, but I think the Republican Party has lost its way, after all it elected a mentally disturbed leader and still live with delusions that they won the election.

Florida is doing just fine? I guess if you see killing over 100 per day (and rising steeply) through gross negligence doesn’t bother you, well...    

“America is founded on principals and one of those is freedom.”

Freedom has been defined as the right to do whatever the hell you want -as long as it doesn’t interfere with someone else’s right to do whatever they want. I would suggest having the right to spread a deadly virus to others violates those people’s freedom.

As long as this virus is allowed to spread and mutate, how long do you think it will become vaccine resistant? Then what?

 

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 PS. Because we had a relatively strict lock down at first in our area, we have been more or less open for business for some time. (Short term pain for long term gain). Tourism (one of our major industries) is more or less back to normal and industries that suffered were offset by those that boomed, like real estate and construction. Our Covid rate is, and has been, quite manageable. However we have been in a unique position where it was easier to control the spread here.  

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LOL its a virus man. Get over it. You guys spent half of last year blaming a virus on one person...thats retarded. Get on with your lives already. The proof is in the numbers. No one wants to be in the areas that did it your way. And the only ones that do waited until things opened up again to come back....

 

Those that dont like it are free to move or stay locked in their homes. 

Edited by Gregmal
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"No one wants to be in the areas that did it your way. "

Once again you are making up your own 'facts'.

For the record, people are clamoring to get in to this area because of the way we have handled the virus and that is why our real estate and construction industry have been booming throughout the pandemic. I can support that with the numbers, but I know you wouldn't pay any attention to them.

“Has Canada even opened their borders yet LOL. Folks dont want to be locked in cages. ”

Have you figured out who's border is still closed, Canada's or the US? Or are you sticking to your own assumptions rather than real facts.

I don't know how it ever became acceptable just to make up things to support arguments but it would seem to have been started by one delusional con artist about five years ago.

Anyway feel free to believe what you want. Right or wrong.

 

 

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Your borders were closed until what? June? And the US guy you wanted in office has the southern open but the northern closed LOL!

Get on with your life man. It s a virus. If you're not decrepit or obese its not really an issue. Like with cancer or anything else, theres cases of people who dont fit the profile being effected but those are rarities. In the south they've been living life normally for over a year and everything is thriving while you folks who dont live there talk about how "out of control" it is(and then lecture about talking about things you dont know anything about!)....and I cant tell whether its jealousy or delusion that keeps people who dont even have anything to do with the area obsessed with it. 

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"I cant tell whether its jealousy or delusion that keeps people who dont even have anything to do with the area obsessed with it."

By allowing it to spread within the country will allow it to spread beyond your borders. Furthermore, the more you allow it to spread the more mutant variants will be produced. What do you propose to do if a variant is produced that is vaccine resistant?

Six hundred thousand Americans have died since you derided people who had concern about the virus and scoffed at the thought that any more than a handful of Americans would ever contract the virus.

Edited by cwericb
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Oh no! Look, now the LAMBDA variant is coming!!!

Bottom line @cwericb and anyone else who is falling for the media and politician bullshit...everyone's going to get covid whether you like it or not. The media benefits massively from the clickbait and politicians benefit from playing the blame game. The narrative being introduced now is straight out of 1930s Germany...basically Republicans are the reason the virus won't go away and they are the enemy and the reason for future lockdowns or restrictions and unfortunate stuff.....

 

For those living in the real world...this is just how something like a virus runs its course. You want to blame anyone, blame the lab folks in Wuhan. Personally, I'm not big on playing the blame game because blaming people means remaining stuck in the past. I like moving forward and anticipating how to play future events. Notice the narrative on vaccines is already shifting from "theyre effective at stopping the virus to.....theyre not meant to stop the virus theyre meant to prevent severe illness....to which eventually it'll change to "they were meant to buy us time".....". Look at the Yankees...they're 90% vaccinated and half the team has had covid in the past month. If you're not old and unhealthy the odds are on your side big time. If you're vaccinated the deck is even more stacked in your favor. But otherwise, shut the fuck up and get on with your life already. One reason I am reasonably good at investing/trading is because to me its easy to connect dots and see where things are going. And for covid, this is how its going to play out. Its just got to run its course and its going to be around for a good while longer....the sooner you see it and accept it the better. The longer you stay locked inside or shutdown, the worse you'll be. But you should be free to make that choice and not have some sniveling woke cunt Karen-ing you about vaccines or masks....

Edited by Gregmal
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Arkansas set a record for hospitalizations, while officials in one Florida county are urging residents to "consider other options" before calling 911. Health officials in Mississippi said the state's hospital system could collapse in five to 10 days if the current trajectory continues.

https://www.npr.org/2021/08/12/1027103023/florida-mississippi-arkansas-hospitals-overwhelmed-covid-19-delta

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14 hours ago, Gregmal said:

basically Republicans are the reason the virus won't go away and they are the enemy and the reason for future lockdowns or restrictions and unfortunate stuff.....

Out of the two parties, I see the anti-vaxxer crowd as largely Republican.  The anti-vaxxers are dragging this out.  We should have reached 80% vaccination rates by now across the country if it weren't for these idiots and the hospitals wouldn't be filling up and there would be no news to report except continued rapid economic recovery.

Instead, these same idiots who are holding up progress are claiming their rights are being violated and mask mandates are unfair, blah blah blah.  

Edited by ERICOPOLY
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The thing we can all agree on is that the Democrats are bleeding hearts. They are.  They won't even let the anti-vaxxers suffer in the hospital if they can try to avoid it.  And they will do what is in their power to avoid deaths of others.

What I would love to see is a movement to make the anti-vaxxers pay for their covid-19 bills out of pocket.  The rest of us who pay for insurance through our taxes, premiums, or through our employers are paying the bills when they get sick.  They will at the very least try what is in their power.

Imagine if you were the insurer being forced to pay for idiots who won't get vaccinated.  Their recklessness is your expense.  Seriously, this isn't a matter of their own personal freedoms when it is putting their hospital bills on the rest of us.  And they increase the risk of more dangerous variants emerging in the future which threatens us all.

Edited by ERICOPOLY
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17 hours ago, Gregmal said:

Its not going away for a very long time. Learn to live with it. 

 

14 hours ago, Gregmal said:

Bottom line @cwericb and anyone else who is falling for the media and politician bullshit...everyone's going to get covid whether you like it or not.

 

The reason why it is not going away is because of idiots who refuse to be vaccinated and wear masks when necessary and cite their ‘freedom’ as their reasoning. Yet their idea of ‘freedom’ inhibits the freedom of everyone else.

They say “No gommerment is going to tell me what to do”.    What a joke.......

You can’t go out and shoot someone just because you don’t like them...
You can’t drive your car at 100 mph down the sidewalk...
You can’t keep a tiger in your back yard...
You can't drive without your seat belt, nor when you are drunk or high...
Why? Because the government says you can’t.

And yet these self centered, arrogant people think it is perfectly fine to refuse to participate in reducing the spread of a virus that is killing thousands of people.

What about the victims freedom to live?

 

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1 hour ago, ERICOPOLY said:

Out of the two parties, I see the anti-vaxxer crowd as largely Republican.  The anti-vaxxers are dragging this out.  We should have reached 80% vaccination rates by now across the country if it weren't for these idiots and the hospitals wouldn't be filling up and there would be no news to report except continued rapid economic recovery.

Instead, these same idiots who are holding up progress are claiming their rights are being violated and mask mandates are unfair, blah blah blah.  

There is a subgroup...sure, but we both know how the political strategists will portray that and the media will as well. 

 

From several people whom I know on the ground throughout(hospital people) FL and VA(brothers a Dr. there), the hospitals actually keep pretty detailed records and the vaccine evidence is obvious. Even on a simple (% of state vax rate) loosely extended into current cases/death....there's clear evidence the vaccine to this point works in preventing deaths. In Lakeland my sister was telling me theyre swamped. But only 11% are folks who are vaccinated. Out of the 11% almost all are immune compromised. Out of the 89% not vaxxed, almost all are overweight, and the age breakdown is 39-60. Skewing younger than last years wave. SO I dont get what people want or need but its up to them.

 

It should be an easy and obvious choice. People like @cwericbare making it out to be like masks are illegal which is not the case. If you want to wear one you have every right to. And you CAN. You just have no right to tell other people that they have to. Pretty simple. 

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