rkbabang Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 From Counterpunch of all places, but this is the best summary of the events of 2017 you will read anywhere. The Year of the Headless Liberal Chicken Just one great paragraph from this most excellent article: "This initial post-election propaganda was understandably somewhat awkward, as the plan had been to be able to celebrate the “Triumph of Love over the Forces of Hate,” and the demise of the latest Hitlerian bogeyman. But this was the risk the ruling classes took when they chose to go ahead and Hitlerize Trump, which they wouldn’t have done if they’d thought for a moment that he had a chance of actually winning the election. That’s the tricky thing about Hitlerizing people. You need to be able to kill them, eventually. If you don’t, when they turn out not to be Hitler, your narrative kind of falls apart, and the people you’ve fear-mongered into a frenzy of frothing, self-righteous fake-Hitler-hatred end up feeling like a bunch of dupes who’ll believe anything the government tells them. This is why, normally, you only Hitlerize foreign despots you can kill with impunity. This is Hitlerization 101 stuff, which the ruling classes ignored in this case, which the left poor liberals terrified that Trump was actually going to start building Trump-branded death camps and rounding up the Jews." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cigarbutt Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 Thought provoking. Between the "simulation of democracy" and the "neo-fascist state", isn't there a space for the politically mobile to switch from the "soft progressive" to the "drain the swamp" adept one day, only to vote for a Democrat in Alabama the next day? There seems to be a lot of crusading ideologies these days but isn't this a way (inelegant perhaps) for the US to be a champion at pragmatic problem solving? From a Canadian with limited political knowledge. From the political standpoint, I mostly just try to wing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 It's been a pleasure to watch. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 I didn't read the article...I'm on vacation and don't want to sully it too much. But there is a lot comparison to HITLER in that quoted paragraph, a dude who tried to murder millions of people. This seems to me like a straw man argument being set up. There are legitimate criticisms of Trump that have nothing to do with genocide. Those are the issues we should be focusing on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 13, 2017 Author Share Posted December 13, 2017 I didn't read the article...I'm on vacation and don't want to sully it too much. But there is a lot comparison to HITLER in that quoted paragraph, a dude who tried to murder millions of people. This seems to me like a straw man argument being set up. There are legitimate criticisms of Trump that have nothing to do with genocide. Those are the issues we should be focusing on. You are correct in that you didn’t read the article. It is a long article and not about Hitler. It basically goes almost month by month since the election. You do remember the Hitler comparisons immediately preceding and following the election though correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted December 13, 2017 Share Posted December 13, 2017 I didn't read the article...I'm on vacation and don't want to sully it too much. But there is a lot comparison to HITLER in that quoted paragraph, a dude who tried to murder millions of people. This seems to me like a straw man argument being set up. There are legitimate criticisms of Trump that have nothing to do with genocide. Those are the issues we should be focusing on. You are correct in that you didn’t read the article. It is a long article and not about Hitler. It basically goes almost month by month since the election. You do remember the Hitler comparisons immediately preceding and following the election though correct? They don't want to hear it, thats why. Remember a month ago someone here starting a thread about how Trump hasn't gotten anything done? Now's tax reform is in the bag and what? I guess we'll see a topic about how 20 years ago he hit on Luc Robataille's wife... Too funny Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobafdek Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 I didn't read the article...I'm on vacation and don't want to sully it too much. But there is a lot comparison to HITLER in that quoted paragraph, a dude who tried to murder millions of people. This seems to me like a straw man argument being set up. There are legitimate criticisms of Trump that have nothing to do with genocide. Those are the issues we should be focusing on. You are correct in that you didnt read the article. It is a long article and not about Hitler. It basically goes almost month by month since the election. You do remember the Hitler comparisons immediately preceding and following the election though correct? Not a straw man. It's still going on. http://www.cnn.com/2017/12/08/politics/barack-obama-nazi-germany/index.html Cheap words that establish Obama as the worst ex-President ever. He needs to be called out on this. Unless he is advocating assassination and violent opposition of Trump supporters, these are Obama weasel words. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Rk, I don't remember any Hitler Comparisons because i can dismiss baloney when I see or hear it. Donald trump isn't Hitler. Is that what you want to hear? In terms of Obamas comments, he didn't even mention Trump or the president or anyone in particular. If anything he was making a comment on our state of democracy in general. So is your post FAKE NEWS? I was part of that thread about what Trump has "gotten done". I wouldn't call the tax bill anything resembling "reform". It just looks like the middle class paying for tax breaks for the wealthiest people. Is that progress? Finally, I'm happy "to hear" any arguments you've got. Most seem a bit ridiculous to me, but I'm happy to call that out as I hear it. Oh yea just to reiterate: trump is not Hitler. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LC Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Oh god, I just read that article. authored by a satirist...no surprise there. It's weird because I can't argue against any of his "points" because they're all true: the media called trump Hitler. The media called him a Russian spy. Etc etc. But it's like, you have 29 kids in the class calling your decisions unintelligent, but you choose to scream at the 1kid calling you the reincarnation of Hitler. That was my sense of it at least. I wouldn't want to be accused of "not wanting to hear it". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Schwab711 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 This article reads like a Jacobin article, but with constant mocking of people who care. Basically doing exactly what folks ripped on the media for doing to Trump supporters. It's basically click-bait, no? Mentioning Hitler is guaranteed eyeballs (clicks/newspaper/magazine). Its obviously a stupid argument by those who use it. It's also probably the most presidential thing associated with Trump. Literally every US President since Hitler has been compared to him by major media outlets. Most have been many times. I have a post about it from pre-election with primary sources for each. You should see the Fox News' Obama/Hitler stuff. It's clearly sensationalist crap. At just about any time, some journalist somewhere is writing/saying something stupid/offensive to the majority of people. Sometimes it's even blatantly false. It does not represent 50% of the population. Don't let Rush ruin your ability to think clearly. He's useful but ultimately an entertainer (like the Daily Show). In general, Trump has doing nothing as President. I'm not saying that in a bad way. I'm saying it as essentially nothing has changed in 1 year. We renewed an old travel restriction with new countries. We even repeated some of the associated court battles. Some EPA regulations changed. Appointed positions changed from D to R, as expected. A few dozen judges have been appointed to fill vacancies. Otherwise, not much other than bare minimum. Trump's presidency is going to be known for golfing at his courses and rustling jimmies at this rate (+ whatever SC concludes) I'd love to see folks who post in these threads compare their pre-election posts to what actually happened. I'd guess most don't even know why they actually support him anymore. All the reasons I remember being posted never happened. Fox News/CNN tracked every Obama and GWB campaign promise. Its like they knew Trump wouldn't actually keep his. I think a lot of folks like the Jimmie rustling and will take whatever leads to that. I have my own opinions of that logic but that is Trump and his administration imo. I don't get why people still see 50% of Americans as the enemy. I've been saying this since early 2015 and I still think it's moronic. The rhetoric remains too dann high. I should add that I don't just mean this site. The WH, Congress, and so on. The world is not ending. The US government is working. We are all fine. I miss when this site had informative and respectful policy debate from various POV. Those were really useful for learning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cobafdek Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 Mentioning Hitler is guaranteed eyeballs (clicks/newspaper/magazine). Its obviously a stupid argument by those who use it. It's also probably the most presidential thing associated with Trump. Literally every US President since Hitler has been compared to him by major media outlets. Most have been many times. I have a post about it from pre-election with primary sources for each. You should see the Fox News' Obama/Hitler stuff. It's clearly sensationalist crap. At just about any time, some journalist somewhere is writing/saying something stupid/offensive to the majority of people. Sometimes it's even blatantly false. It does not represent 50% of the population. Don't let Rush ruin your ability to think clearly. He's useful but ultimately an entertainer (like the Daily Show). This is all good and correct. How do you account for Obama engaging in it? Why couldn't he use the sensible words of the type you just posted? Don't you agree he deserves special censure, given his status as ex-President? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 In general, Trump has doing nothing as President. I'm not saying that in a bad way. I'm saying it as essentially nothing has changed in 1 year. There have been some small changes (regulations, maybe a tax cut soon, etc), but I mostly agree with your point. So why do you think there has been so much absolutely insane hysteria on the left like nothing we have ever seen in the United States before since the election over what has largely been a non-event? This is what the article is getting at. Liberals have never liked Republican presidents and Conservatives have never liked Democratic presidents, yeah we are all used to that, but the level of outrage and lunacy and hyperbolic rage sustained for over a year now is something completely new in our society. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliG Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 ^^^ Fox News tweet is promoting a quote from one of its contributors. "I think the FBI's been compromised. Forget about shutting down Mr. Mueller. Do we need to shut down the @FBI because it was turned into a KGB-type operation by the Obama administration?" Both sides are guilty of hyperbolic rhetoric. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DTEJD1997 Posted December 14, 2017 Share Posted December 14, 2017 In general, Trump has doing nothing as President. I'm not saying that in a bad way. I'm saying it as essentially nothing has changed in 1 year. There have been some small changes (regulations, maybe a tax cut soon, etc), but I mostly agree with your point. So why do you think there has been so much absolutely insane hysteria on the left like nothing we have ever seen in the United States before since the election over what has largely been a non-event? This is what the article is getting at. Liberals have never liked Republican presidents and Conservatives have never liked Democratic presidents, yeah we are all used to that, but the level of outrage and lunacy and hyperbolic rage sustained for over a year now is something completely new in our society. The left if very upset that Hillary did not win...they are going to be agitating for the foreseeable future like never before. The right was upset when Obama won, and there were rumblings of discontent...but NOTHING like what we've got going on now. I think that there is a definite chance of a coup or uprising or mass civil unrest. I don't think it is highly likely...but it is more likely than at probably any point since the civil war. What are the odds that there is a "black swan" event and the left does something crazy? Certainly greater than zero. I think it is also greater than 1-2-3 percent....Not that it is like 50-50, but might be something like 10% or 20%. I hope I'm wrong obviously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 14, 2017 Author Share Posted December 14, 2017 ^^^ Fox News tweet is promoting a quote from one of its contributors. "I think the FBI's been compromised. Forget about shutting down Mr. Mueller. Do we need to shut down the @FBI because it was turned into a KGB-type operation by the Obama administration?" Both sides are guilty of hyperbolic rhetoric. Of course and always have been. What you don't see on the right is people panicking and outraged. I have some gay friends who were in actual distress after the election and really thought that they would have to flee the country in the near future to save their lives. There has never been that kind delusion on the right after any presidential election. Nothing this wide-spread and nothing this long lasting. I know you are trying very hard not to see this, but it is so out of proportion to anything else we've ever seen in the history of the United States you can't honestly tell me that you don't see what I'm talking about. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliG Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 The right was upset when Obama won, and there were rumblings of discontent...but NOTHING like what we've got going on now. There has never been that kind delusion on the right after any presidential election. Nothing this wide-spread and nothing this long lasting. Tea Party says hello. Folks have short memories. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 The right was upset when Obama won, and there were rumblings of discontent...but NOTHING like what we've got going on now. There has never been that kind delusion on the right after any presidential election. Nothing this wide-spread and nothing this long lasting. Tea Party says hello. Folks have short memories. What a bunch of people who wanted lower taxes? I closely followed the tea party there was more delusion on the part of the liberal press that reported on it than there was in it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 The right was upset when Obama won, and there were rumblings of discontent...but NOTHING like what we've got going on now. There has never been that kind delusion on the right after any presidential election. Nothing this wide-spread and nothing this long lasting. Tea Party says hello. Folks have short memories. What a bunch of people who wanted lower taxes? I closely followed the tea party there was more delusion on the part of the liberal press that reported on it than there was in it. Not to mention that the Tea Party faction was maybe at it's peak, 20% of Republicans(while Republicans were in the minority), with at best, Fox News as it's only major outlet for "mainstream" propaganda. Nothing close to resembling the current media/leftist environment. Don't mind Eli. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EliG Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 What a bunch of people who wanted lower taxes? I closely followed the tea party there was more delusion on the part of the liberal press that reported on it than there was in it. They were rabidly anti-Obama, as much as liberals are rabidly anti-Trump now. They ostensibly wanted lower deficits and debt, but now the very same people are happily voting for a bill that would add $1.5 trillion to the deficit. It's as if Obama hatred was *the* driving force, while everything else was just tactics. But anyway, here's a (former?) Republican running around like a headless chicken... or maybe he is right? "Friends, the president and his far-right supporters in Congress are laying the groundwork to fire Mueller, especially as his investigation encircles the Trump family. This is not a drill. Please call your reps in Congress today and urge them to protect Mueller with legislation." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 15, 2017 Author Share Posted December 15, 2017 What a bunch of people who wanted lower taxes? I closely followed the tea party there was more delusion on the part of the liberal press that reported on it than there was in it. They were rabidly anti-Obama, as much as liberals are rabidly anti-Trump now. They ostensibly wanted lower deficits and debt, but now the very same people are happily voting for a bill that would add $1.5 trillion to the deficit. It's as if Obama hatred was *the* driving force, while everything else was just tactics. But anyway, here's a (former?) Republican running around like a headless chicken... or maybe he is right? "Friends, the president and his far-right supporters in Congress are laying the groundwork to fire Mueller, especially as his investigation encircles the Trump family. This is not a drill. Please call your reps in Congress today and urge them to protect Mueller with legislation." LOL. I never once in 8 years ran into a single Republican who really thought that Obama was "literally Hitler" and was under real emotional distress about it or thought that it was only a matter of time before them and their families would have to flee the country in the middle of the night to save their lives. They opposed Obama and worried about socialized medicine and higher taxes, which are real policy concerns. Some of them worried needlessly that Obama was going to be soft on terrorism (I say needlessly because he ended up being far more bloodthirsty than Bush/Cheney in that area), but again one way or the other that is a policy concern. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gregmal Posted December 15, 2017 Share Posted December 15, 2017 https://pagesix.com/2017/12/15/lisa-bloom-tried-to-solicit-cash-from-media-for-trump-sexual-misconduct-accusers/?_ga=2.253070282.2126526773.1512338291-800985890.1509751773 #metoo$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rkbabang Posted December 16, 2017 Author Share Posted December 16, 2017 https://pagesix.com/2017/12/15/lisa-bloom-tried-to-solicit-cash-from-media-for-trump-sexual-misconduct-accusers/?_ga=2.253070282.2126526773.1512338291-800985890.1509751773 #metoo$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ For $750k I can conjure up some tears and talk about the awful things Trump did to me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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